For a while now, I’ve wanted to put my name to my story. The internal hang ups were many, but I feel I’m at a point now where my story and experience are what they are, and I can’t control what anyone else thinks of them. I’m learning to tell my story without specific expectations of how people should react. I’m grateful for that, and recognize it will be a daily battle for me to let people come to their own conclusions.
Part of this journey of letting people believe what they may is presenting facts about my experiences and interactions and not overexplaining them. I didn’t pull these phrases from my memory so I could come running with a pitchfork and at the same time, I will not simply stand by and watch while people continue to hurt and be hurt. So, a fairly simple list follows of things I was told over my years at the church I called home. Some were said by the pastor, others by prominent members of the church. In quotations are conversations I remember almost word for word. If there aren’t quotation marks it just means I don’t remember the exact wording
I am more relationally invested in your marriage than your marriage counselor is. It won’t really matter to her how your marriage ends up, but your marriage does impact me and reflect on me.
“It’s not just your big day [referring to weddings]. It’s also the church’s big day. It’s my big day.” (You can read this for yourself in the pastor’s book. I’m unfamiliar with any Biblical reference to weddings also being the pastor’s big day.)
“Did you have any fault in that scenario?” -Me
“Not really, I mean, we followed Matthew 18 to a T.” -Pastor
The consensus among healthy marriages I am aware of is that they have sex about 3-4 times per week.
In a conversation with the pastor about porn, I expressed concern that porn often involves abuse of individuals and is also proven to fuel the demand for sex trafficking. A portion of his response was, “Yeah, sure, porn fuels sex trafficking and all that, but also it’s just childish.” In that same conversation, he made a statement along the lines of, “Why would a guy look at porn when he can experience sex with a real woman?”
“I am confident we have talked to everyone who has been affected by [that scenario].” (I can factually tell you that was not the case.)
“Men need a lot of sex.”
“I really want a high trust culture.”
The pastor and I were alone in his office talking about power dynamics. He acknowledged his power as a pastor, then said, “You know, something people don’t like to talk about is the power the other way around. You have a lot of power, you have a whole community of people in this church who love you and would trust anything you said about what happened in this room.”
I also want to include what the network this church is a part of has to say about women in leadership, because I don’t feel it’s something many people are aware of: ”We are a complementarian network committed to the principle of equal value, but differing roles as prescribed in the Epistles. As such, churches that join the network must have a male lead pastor. Women have the authority to lead females and youth but not the church family. We take this position without malice or apology as we are committed to the Historic Biblical view.”
Prominent church member: “Stay or get out.”
Me: “Are you asking us to leave [this church]?”
Church member: “No…yes…I’m just concerned you and [your spouse] can’t hear God’s voice clearly because of your bias against [the pastor].”
And so, having been asked to “stay or get out” and told my spouse and I couldn’t accurately hear God’s voice simply because we were not wholeheartedly, blindly supporting our pastor, we left.
I feel there is actually a fairly simple path forward now that so many issues within this church have come to light. The path involves repentance and humility of all parties. The path involves curiosity and a willingness to be corrected. Many things mystify me about how our season at the church came to a close, but I continually return to this thought: Why are people so sure one person or organization can do no wrong? I have done wrong in different areas of my life. I have hurt dear friends unintentionally. I also consider myself someone with good morals, ethics, and character, and yet, I have caused harm to others at times. Believing one specific person can do no wrong leaves no room for God’s grace and mercy to enter. On some level, we must recognize and believe that we are wretches without the goodness of God. We steal opportunities to have God’s mercy lavished on us when we believe we are mostly good and therefore not at fault since our intentions were good. And, it goes much deeper than just having the knowledge that we can hurt people. It involves listening and learning when someone tells you you have hurt them. Your intentions are part of the story, but they aren’t the whole story. My intention to not hurt my friend doesn’t really matter to her when she is actually feeling really hurt by me. I can scream “I didn’t mean to hurt you!” till I’m blue in the face, but that does nothing to actually repair the damage that was done.
What I experienced at this church was the appearance of a belief that certain individuals could do no wrong. Sure, those people admitted they were sinners and had made mistakes, but it seemed that if their intentions were good (and they always, always were) then it was the responsibility of the offended person to accept the non-apology apology and move on. Relationships will break down in the long term if they are founded on this dynamic, and I think we saw that in the last year, when multiple families who had invested 7+ years in the church felt that their only option was to walk away.
I’ll end with the wise words of my sister. “Those people were doing their best, but they don’t understand power dynamics and so their best was harmful. And that’s sad.”
Kathryn Schneider (née Beseth)
